Emails to Daemons Discuss!

Daemons Discuss - an unoffical All Souls Universe Podcast, based on the All Souls Trilogy by Deborah Harkness - Episode #

Take 89 (published the 21st of November 2021)

Dear Daemons,
Here are some of my thoughts on chapter 20 (it’s a bit long).
Being summoned away from your bed in the middle of the night always spells crisis. In this case Jack’s trance-like and manic drawing. We also get a glimpse of Diana trying to learn how to parent a son who is a predator in human form through Miriam’s articles on wolves. Love that. She will need that when her own babies are born, too.
Deb’s description of Jack’s drawings is very evocative – van Dyck crossed with Picasso – I think of detailed Dutch renaissance paintings with their dark backgrounds and Picasso’s Guernica superimposed, a very disturbing way of depicting people. Jack’s charcoal studies of important details that tell old stories of physical abuse and new stories of Benjamin’s cruelty, and Jack’s attempts at being kind and helpful despite Benjamin’s influence. Portraying Benjamin as almost an abstract vision makes him seem even more dangerous.
Even without illustrations I get a feeling from Deb’s prose of immense artistry from Jack (the daemon, creative part of his genetic heritage, I imagine.)
Then there’s the music: The St. Matthew’s Passion, the Lacrimosa, Beethoven concerto, and Fauret’s Requiem. The description of Matthew reciting the prayers for the dead over the deaths of Philippe, Hugh, and every other person he has loved and lost, and whose deaths he feels responsible for, is haunting.
The music all deals with dying, death, judgement, resurrection – starting with the Passion, moving on to the judgement (the Lacrimosa) and ending with ‘In Paradisum’ – the resurrection.
It is both clever and empathetic of Matthew (and brilliantly conceived by deb) to choose music that can follow Jack’s drawings of horrors and bring him out of it through a metaphorical Christian Easter  – starting with the passion and ending with the resurrection, and through that the hope for a better future, as expressed through Jack’s drawing of Diana.
Deb has Matthew think that though he can make Jack feel safe like a father, it is Diana’s love that provides redemption for Jack. We are seeing Jack through Matthew’s eyes, and he tends to underestimate his own value, so I’m not sure that he is quite right in this, or whether that is really what Deb thinks. What he is doing with the music is also an expression of love, after all. In a true family the love of a father is just as important as the love of a mother, and even a patriarchal father does not only provide safety and order. But at this stage Diana is more approachable to Jack. He is in awe of Matthew.
Chris’ willingness to help provide Jack with a support network is very down to earth and practical, and most of us need more than one person in our network to function well. This side of Chris redeems his earlier craziness – even if he does use the situation for his genetics research too, and worries whether Jack can be trusted around Diana. And we get the information that blood rage is incurable – not good news for Matthew and his family, but important for where the story goes from here.
Looking forward to chapter 21, to Baldwin and the start of the journey towards the new scion.
Things are looking up here in Denmark, COVID restrictions lifted without a large, new surge of COVID cases – touch wood.
Birgit Hartoft

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Take 87 (published the 26th of September 2021)

From Kristin:

Dear Angela, Jean and Valerie

Oh boy, Chapter 18 – hold onto your lap bar because this rollercoaster is about to get interesting!  Jack, Lobero (must be version/number 40 by now??), Andrew Hubbard and reams of revelations.  So many ‘conversational bombs’, secrets being uncovered, pain re-lived but the joy of reunions is probably even stronger (Corra and Jack are adorable, as is Jack for still being ‘childlike’ despite being over 400 years old).

This where yet more consequences of Matthew’s and Diana’s past actions (individually and jointly) really come home to roost.  Jack’s painful life, yet more of Philippe’s secrets, Benjamin’s interference, vampire murders… you can almost visibly see the weight increasing on Matthew’s shoulders and his own sense of self-worth going downhill yet again.

As much as the reunion with Jack is huge, it’s always Andrew Hubbard who sticks in my mind after this chapter.  When I first read TBOL this was the chapter that completely shook my point of view of AH.  Creepy and prickly on first reading of SON but here showing strength, loyalty, fierce caring and a complexity of loyalties that makes my head ache.  Jack has been through so much pain and yet it seems like AH has been constant guide through it until the recent past.  I still don’t think I really understand the depth of that loyalty – AH had no reason for loyalty to the De Clermonts and yet he’s helped keep Jack away from Matthew for centuries.  My guessing is Philippe’s orders (and the fact that the ‘old’ Matthew wouldn’t know anything about Jack anyway) – but that just shows how complex AH’s fine line of operating between the De Clermonts and Benjamin really is.

Loved that Philippe ‘really was as big as the emperor’s bear’ and that Jack smelled of ‘coal fires and foggy mornings’ (as a Brit living in Virginia for nearly 12 years that really made me think of autumn in London - just a touch of homesickness!)

However, this chapter always leaves me with so many unanswered questions.  Mainly how did Jack and AH find Matthew and Diana and how did they know to do so now and not at any point in the previous 400+ years?  How did Jack escape Benjamin and find AH again?  I have a feeling that Jack’s life is a whole other book that Deb could yet write (yes please!)

Looking forward as ever to hearing what you have to say about this chapter and hope you have a relaxing rest of your Labor day weekend๐Ÿท๐Ÿน


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Take 72 (published the 30th of July 2020)

From Olivia:
Dear Angela, Jean and Valerie

Hope you are all okay and thanks again for all your hard work. Highlight of my week.

Okay, you are going to think I have completely lost the plot here but these are the connections that go round in my head (lockdown doesn't help). Bear with me, this is ADOW related.....

I have been drowning (happily) in Handel, Gluck and Purcell operas over the past couple of years while I have been writing. They are what I like to call 'silver tone' operas. The music is glittery, open aired, light, undemanding and exquisitely beautiful - and the stories are often about a sorceress, elves, mystical kingdoms, etc. And they are rather chaste.

The 19th century operas of Verdi and Puccini, on the other hand, are complex, dark  and passionate - real hairs on the back of your neck music. 'Burnished gold' is how I describe them. They are rollercoasters of human emotions, stunningly beautiful, cathartic. I can't listen to them when I write as they demand so much of you, it's impossible to concentrate on anything else. They reduce you to tears a lot of the time and many are deeply sensual. Many opera lovers (who keep going back) would not dispute that; listen to Tosca or Carmen.

I am listening to Verdi's Don Carlo at the moment. The story is interesting. Don Carlo (1545-1568) is the son of Phillip 11 of Spain (widower of Queen Mary). In real life, he was completely bonkers, thanks to years of inbreeding amongst the Habsburgs and the Royal families of Portgual. (Matthew and Miriam would have a field day with this.) Of course, Verdi subverts the story and turns it into a passionate love story with some of the most powerful music ever written. (If you are interested, check out the EMI recording with Placido Domingo, Monserat Caballรฉ conduced by Carlo Maria Guilini). I do realise opera is not everyone's cup of tea so don't feel obliged.

Anyway, back to ADOW. Musically, Diana is Handel, Matthew, is Verdi*

Sarah, Emm, Phoebe and even Peter Knox are Handel.

Phillippe, Isabeau, Gerbert, Dominique, Baldwin, Marcus and Juliette are Verdi.

*well maybe not buttoned down, controlled 21st Century Matthew or gentle pre vampire Matthew but my god, 16th century Matthew definitely has it in spades. Yes, I know he behaves very badly towards Diana, particularly in light of twenty-first century mores, but dear God, he is hot. Or is that just me?


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Take 71 (published the 13th of July 2020

From Lyndsey  

Hello to my favorite Daemons!

Right now, I'm sitting through a very tedious online zoom class and I figured that this would be a much more productive use of my time :)

Here is just a collection of thoughts you can use some, all, or none of it. I just figured that I would send some ideas your way.

Would you rather questions:
1. (If you could jump into a book) Would you rather be a bystander character in Shadow of Night or Book of Life? 
2.  Would you rather be a personal assistant to Domenico or Gerbert?
3.  If you could have 1 hour, one-on-one, with a character to ask them anything you wanted, would you rather talk to Phillipe or Ysabeau?
4. If you had a familiar, would you rather it take an animal-like form (like corra or a griffin) or a human-like form (like a golem or Goody's fetch)?

Random Tangent- At the beginning of chapter 3 it says, "every inch of Baldwin's muscular frame was taut with anger and banked strength." Was I the only one thinking "yes please! Sounds good to me!" If I'm alone in this, just ignore me, no worries :)

On a different note....When I was reading the part where Alain is giving Diana her belongings, I wondered what I would put into a box to represent this time in my life. This shelter in place has been a a uniquely challenging situation, but I have also had some really interesting experiences and I have had time to reflect on my life. I think that this could be an interesting exercise for us. If you had to box up a few items that represent your experience during quarantine/shelter in place, what would you choose? My "box" would consist of a bottle of tequila and a lime, a stack of magic-fantasy novels, yoga pants, and a lawn chair.

I love you three so much! Listening to your podcast always brightens my day, and I always look forward to hearing what you have to say. Also, I love the "Barbara Files"! She should start her own podcast or blog or something, I would definitely tune in!

Sending good vibes your way

Take 69 (published the 28th of May 2020)

From Persephone

Dear Daemons

So hoping you and your families are well. My husband and I are lucky to be able to stay safe at home but we are anxious for our younger relatives: my niece is a hospital doctor and our daughter-in-law is a psychologist currently redeployed on the front line in a London hospital. While we are certainly living the fear, there are  still aspects of life that are good, such as the Spring blossom, starting off vegetable growing and trying to bake with different flour! Another antidote has been reading JK Rowling’s ‘Strike’ novels, re-reading and re-watching anything and everything to do with ‘All Souls’ and Matthew Goode (Just watched his new film for kids, ‘Four Children and It’ in which he is a delight) and of  course, listening to your fabulously uplifting selves! In addition, the younger generation on Instagram are hilariously inventive. Check out Ed Bluemel, who is dressing up in a different costume from his childhood every day, while Theresa Palmer’s insights into her family life are like a beautiful film!

As for your prompts:

·        Would you Rather… I love these things! How about:

Would you rather put your faith in Matthew, Miriam and Marcus in the lab or Diana, Sarah and the ghosts in the still room to find a solution to the world pandemic?

·        Bloodrage

I like that we are given more insight into Matthew’s struggle with bloodrage and that his conversations with the lovely Hamish and dreamboat Fernando help us understand its powerful hold on Matthew. The trigger for this onslaught of rage is surely understandable: just imagine that a murder of a close family member has occurred while you’re away and nothing has been done about it! I would be pretty raging myself. And we are reminded that Matthew has to experience returning to a Sept Tours without Philippe all over again. But we are also told that mating increases the effects of his rage which makes us re-examine Matthew’s behaviour with Diana so far and perhaps understand some of his past inexplicable acts. But then, we are told that Marcus and Hamish don’t know about bloodrage! What?!? Trouble ahead, surely…

·        The check-ins

Love all the scenes with the boys but I am still not sure, even post ‘Times Convert’, how I feel about Phoebe. I do remember not liking how quickly she snagged Marcus and got accepted by Isabeau but cannot deny that she has immense courage when she meets Matthew in this chapter. I want more details of how Marcus and Phoebe’s romance got to this stage!

·        Diana

The love-making scene is very beautifully written and it is fabulous how equal Matthew and Diana’s relationship has become, with each of them able to connect and comfort the other on so many levels!

·        Baldwin

Baldwin’s interruption is such a stark contrast to the dreamy love-scene. Can you imagine the cringe-worthy embarrassment of being interrupted in such a moment and -how dare he pull back the sheet in that way! It is so deftly managed as a dramatic moment in which we are reminded again of the juxtaposition of ancient vampires and the modern world. Baldwin’s attitude to females, marriage and the hierarchy in his family and of course, his complete ignorance of where Matthew and Diana have been are obviously going to clash with everyone in the castle. A real page turner!

All the best to you all and as always, so many thanks for being there, rock-solid reliable on Thursdays. I loved Take 67!
Please be safe and keep well.



Take 49 (published the 18th of April 2019) emails

 From Stephen

Shadow of Night, Chapter 23
Following my latest read of Chapter 23, I picked up on the topic of Goody Alsop’s house ghosts gossiping about a spectral squabbling near Newgate Street. This was in the chapter before Diana wove her forspell with the Garlickhythe gathering.
Newgate Street is now at the southern end of the A40 in London, north-west from St Paul’s Underground station. The New Gate itself was an entrance in the Roman London City wall and ditch, near the present day intersection of Old Bailey, Giltspur Street and Newgate Street. A Franciscan Grey Friars church was established on Newgate Street, within the city walls, from 1255 until the dissolution in 1538. The church on this site was destroyed in the Great Fire of London in 1666, and is currently the location a modern building of the finance house, Merrill Lynch.
One of the squabbling ghosts was the medieval Queen Isabella of France, who was born in Paris in 1295. Following her marriage to King Edward 11 of England in 1308 (at the age of 12) Isabella was Queen consort of England. By 1312, Isabella was estranged from King Edward 11, following his alleged homosexual relationships. In 1326, Isabella, with her lover, Roger Mortimer, deposed the King Edward 11.  {Warning, the following text is graphic}. Following Edward’s capture and imprisonment at the request of Isabella, he was reported to have been killed by being sodomised with a red-hot poker.  
Isabella donated a tenement to the Greyfriars in 1353 or 1354, and was buried in the church there, after her death in 1358. At her request, she was interred with a casket containing Edward’s heart. In his book ‘Walking Haunted London’, Richard Jones writes that the ghost of Isabella clutches Edward’s ghost heart, as she haunts Greyfriars.
The other ghost was Lady Agnes Hungerford. In 1518, Agnes and her first husband John Cotell were staying at Farleigh Hungerford castle, near Bath in Somerset. During their stay, Agnes incited her two servants to strangle her husband, and dispose of the body by cremation in the castle oven. Shortly after this Agnes and the owner of the castle, Sir Edward Hungerford, were married. Sir Edward died in 1522, leaving the castle and all possessions to his wife, Agnes. However, shortly afterwards, the new widow and her servants were charged with the murder of her first husband. Lady Agnes and one of her servants were convicted, and then publicly hanged in February 1523 /1524 at Tyburn London. After her execution, Lady Agnes Hungerford was buried in Greyfriars church.
In the books ‘Walking Haunted London’ and J A Brook’s ‘Ghosts of London’, these two mariticide ghosts met within Greyfriars and a night watchman got ‘caught in the midst’ of their fight’. The watchman was so scared that he fled and gave up his job.
From Chloe

Finally the chapter reviews! My thoughts on this chapter might be a bit controversial to everyone else, but I didn’t hate Matthew here. He is stressed and terrified that something will happen to Diana because something always goes wrong for Matthew.

The miscarriage I know upset a lot of people when he was high after a night out with Kit, but I always saw it as Matthew reliving the other children he’s lost and not knowing how to cope.

Blood rage doesn’t help much either with his possessive tendencies coming to the forefront because they are now fully committed to each other.

The bit that pulled at me the most night seem an odd choice but stick with me! The sex against the wall you could feel their anger and desperation for it to go back to how it was before even though they know it can’t.

Ok that’s my thoughts your vampire down under love the show daemon divas!

From Megg

Daerest Daemons (see what I did there!),
This is my first discussion prompt and I have been so excited to write you all! Let me start by saying how inexplicably grateful I am for the All Souls fan-community, especially you three! My discovery of the All Souls trilogy was super random, but I think serendipity happens that way most of the time! On a travel account I follow on Instagram, someone posted a picture of a person riding on a train in Korea and resting on the seat of the train were a couple books, one of them being A Discovery of Witches. The title intrigued me and I had been looking for an audiobook for an upcoming 6-hour drive, so I checked it out from my library. I was hooked INSTANTLY! I listened to all three books non-stop (Jennifer Ikeda is AH-mazing!) and even before I had finished listening to Book of Life, I had bought all of the books and started reading them too, along with listening. It was also from a random ad on Instagram that I learned the series was being made into a TV show. My own "Discovery" fell into my lap so perfectly! At one point, I was listening to Book of Life on audiobook, reading Shadow of Night, and repeatedly binge-watching the first season all at the same time. I'm THAT obsessed! In the last 4 months, I have read the trilogy twice, listened to all three audiobooks, watched season one three times, read Time's Convert, and the World of All Souls Guide. So, all that to say, I have absolutely loved becoming a part of this fandom family!

Regarding Shadow of Night, chapter 23: One of the things I found fascinating about Diana's preparations for casting her forspell, was that Goody Alsop had to cut the threads surrounding Diana in order to prepare her to weave her first spell. This seemed to me a symbolic act of Diana having to accept being cut free from her previous life of shunning her magic before she could wield the threads that make up her new identity as a weaver. Though she had recently experienced death in the loss of her baby, the act of weaving her forspell is its own experience of rebirth and new life.

Thanks again for your amazing podcast and dedication to the All Souls World!
-Megg Rapp
From Becca

Hi ladies!!

So I am emailing about our next SON chapter. This is a life affirming chapter for me.

I have shared with most that I had 4 miscarriages in a 14 month period of time. This chapter became a beacon for me because it talked about it, it made it a real thing that happens and not this hush hush thing that so many women are forced to suffer through on their own.

It is a point of pride for me, Deb and I have had discussions in the Discussion Group about why she chose to add this to Diana’s story.

Fast forward to the Con where during the xxxxxxxxxxxxx (redacted) panel. One of the commentators said Deb added it to the story to show how far medical treatment has come and that it does not happen as often. Many in the audience verbally disagreed. I was just enraged. They took this truly meaningful thing and desecrated it.

Deb chose to add the miscarriage to the story because a friend of hers had one and Deb never knew. She felt bad that her friend suffered this loss and no one knew she was hurting. This of course was a layer of healing in my recovery of a major mental breakdown after suffering my own losses .

You can find it using the search function. I am going to email you my screenshot as proof, as long as you are all in the group.

If there is going to be this difficult conversation I want it to be right. Feel free to share this with the listeners. Awareness is so important and dear to me.

Love to you all!!

From Emily

Oh my gosh i love this chapter. okay, I love every chapter of all the books but still.
I cried when I found out she lost the baby, it was her first miscarriage and Matthew's SECOND!!! :(
BUT was convinced that when she was pregnant she would have twins,as they both disagreed about gender-I was like well Diana wouldn't be wrong about her baby..but then I was like..neither would Matthew! So i just thought oh they should get twins and I was rightt ayyyy! This book is so great because even though things happen you wouldn't expect,it wasnt wrong or out of place,it just felt right,like everything that happened i just thought..well...Deb is a bloody Genius.
When Diana says this:
Because Matthew has endured a thousand years of heartbreak and I've only endured thirty-three," I said, my tone equally sharp.
I was like ooooo damn, but yes Elizabeth shove off. Diana can be an absolute savage when she wants to. I love her.
Matthew wasn't there to start with and I was like Matthew should be with Diana at all times, especially after this as he knows what it must be like, but then he believes Bianca didn't love him, he did at the time,but looking back,what this must do to someone is just....gosh..Matthew also blames himself for everything so you can understand why he wasn't there, you can't expect him to be with her when this has happened with Bianca before,we know this must set off his bloodrage,and he has mated with Diana so it must be even more heartbreaking!
 I was surprised actually I thought he handled it fairly well.
This whole book just made me contradict myself about 30 times too, so that was fun.
"I just wish he could touch me without regret."  THIS LINE KILLED ME.
Also the fact Matthew has to relive his life again-god that would drive me insane!
Love you guys thanks for the amazing podcasts!
From Michelle

Hello lovely Daemons,

I've re-read chapter 23 about three times now. Even with so much going on, and all the heartbreak and transformation, what I keep coming back to are the requests for magic that Diana finds at the start.

Who are these people asking for help? Why are they so desperate that they're hoping a witch (of whom they're probably afraid) will help them?

It might be unfair, but it's a moment where I get angry with Matthew, in a section where it's already very easy to get angry with Matthew.

Why does he feel it's okay, both to decide for Diana, and to deny these people help? If half the town knows she's a witch, what does she risk by helping people?

I'd love to hear your thoughts on this, and whether this is another case of Hot Mess Matthew, or if he is right... for once.

All the best,

Michelle xo
From Monika

Namaste Daemon Ladies ๐Ÿ™

My thoughts regarding Chapter 23 are quite vivid. For me, three of the most significant things that happened in this chapter are, the aftermath of Diana's miscarriage, the witchcraft practices of Garlickhythe gathering of witches and the forespell, that lead to the first appearance of Diana’s familiar, a Firedrake, our very own Corra.

What amazes me is that the chapter has an encounter of the Goddess too. Along with the inclusion of the first book's (A Discovery of Witches) epigraph in the closing lines of the chapter, when Diana was able to figure out the connection between her familiar and Matthew's emblem via the Alchemical wedding painting in Sidney's lab.
This time, while rereading, I also noticed the two annoying specters that were squabbling in the Newgate Street, where Goody Alsop resided.
The medieval Queen Isabella of France (died 1358) and Lady Agnes Hungerford (executed in 1524 for murdering her first husband by burning his body), were both buried in the Christchurch Greyfriars, that's just a 2 minutes walk away from this street, now lieing in ruins as a garden, after the damage done to it during WWII.
Another thing common between these women, apart from their common burial place is that, both of them were involved in the murder of their husbands.
This was all I looked up on Web regarding these ladies and thought of sharing with you.
That's all for today ๐Ÿ˜.

I'm always eager to listen your intelligent and funny thoughts regarding the World Of All Souls ๐Ÿ’•
Keep up the good work !

Thanks Again

From Stacey

Hi Daemons!

I feel like Chapter 23 is the turning point of the series. I never really thought of it before, I just listened and enjoyed the whole story. It's just over the halfway point of Shadow of Night, making it just about the hallway point of Diana's journey. A fitting place for her to start getting so many answers and moving forward in her journey.

On a side note, this chapter also had me realizing something about myself. My fiance & I play Magic the Gathering (the card game). In the game there are 5 colors (red, blue, white, black, and green) and each color has it's own characteristics of the magic spells and abilities. I play a lot of red & blue (fire & water) and black & white (life & death). It hit me today listening to this chapter that these are the corresponding colors to Diana's magic. I started playing after I read the series, so I wonder if the books impacted my choices in the game.

Daemon kisses,



Take 42 (published the 26th of July) emails

**From Ana
Hey Daemons, it’s your discusser Anna from London - with my thoughts on chapter 18.  I’ve sent this as a SpeakPipe message but couldn’t hear well the playback so not sure it actually got through :)

Anyways...I think what I love most about this Chapter is the dialogue.

First the chatty Diana.  Seeing  almost new side of her: carefree, enjoying herself and her budding friendship with Mary Dudley.

Then there’s the dialogue when the summons from Father Hubbard arrive.  On first read of this passage  I thought whoops Diana, payback time for your trip across London. On subsequent reads, it was more:  what the hell were you thinking Matthew!   My favourite laugh out loud line is Diana quietly wanting to throttle Matthew: Stop looking out the window. I’m tired of talking to the back of your head’

As we get into Hubbards den – Matthew’s trying his alpha male approach in talking with Father Hubbard.  While not the  wisest approach, I did like cocky Matthew there!

And when picturing father Hubbard I could only think about Max von Sydow....

Thankfully Diana does take over the  control of that conversation,  and puts her foot down back at home on subject of finding a witch teacher for herself.   The chaper ended for me with a chuckle over  closing lines from Gallowglass: when Phillipe says he’s trusting his’s wife’s judgement, is just about when all hell breaks loose.

Also wanted to say I can’t get enough of the TV trailer.  I keep secretly re-watching at work since Monday.  I don’t really care about ‘diversions from cannon’ becaue I feel they are doing a brilliant job creating this world and i just wnat to enjoy it.  plus Matthew and Teras are not that hard on the eye, as well as rest of crew!  wonder if you like Baldwin?  seen from Uk perspective - great way to show arrogance personified :)

That’s all from me, hugs and kisses and can’t wait for next episode!


**From Lisa

Hello Lovely Daemons,
Can you even imagine what a warm and welcoming feeling it was to be asked to repost a question so disputed in megachurch??!! So thank you one and thanks to each of the individuals who participated.

Shelli made the comment about moving the puzzle pieces around. To me that is at least part of what’s happening in Ch. 18. The reader isn’t aware that Andrew knows he is “related” to the de Clermonts. Yet that is in Andrew’s knowledge bank. This read I kept that in mind. And suddenly the Chapter seemed different. It seemed much more of a measure taking. I couldn’t help but wonder what kind of relationship Andrew and Philippe had. Andrews contempt for Matthew almost seemed more understandable. Not to say he was right, but in context more reasonable. Imagine being turned by Benjamin, abandoned, and then your Granfather showing up and acting lord of the manor!! So I guess, I understand why Andrew moved his puzzle pieces they way he did.

Love all the Daemons! Really sad I won’t be in Philly. Maybe next year.

Much love, Daemon kisses, and Goddess Blessings,

From NE Angela!
Good Morning Daemons

Most of the All Souls Family is working their way through their tenth watch of the TV show trailer...

I will go back shortly for my eleventh ;)

However, I wanted to ask a quick question in regards to Andrew Hubbard.

We know that during the London plague of 1349 (?) Benjamin turns him into a vampire. Do we know why it is Benjamin never revealed his maker to Matthew in 1590? Or why Benjamin chose Hubbard? Was it that Hubbard didn't know the link yet between Matthew and Benjamin until Philippe interfered?

I keep going back to TBOL for some answers but it seems I'm missing something that would tell me how Hubbard found out Benjamin was Matthew's son. Hubbard only knew Benjamin wanted to rage a war against The DeClaremonts but never said why.


Daemon Kisses

From Michelle:
Hello Daemons!

Andrew Hubbard, the character I most love to hate.  In this chapter, once again Matthew's arrogance, decisions and lack of planning causes him problems.  My first impressions of Father Hubbard is that of a modern day cult leader.  He takes care of his people and brings in those most vulnerable which is admirable if they were ever permitted the choice to leave.  I do not believe his "children" are ever free of him, but could the same be said about Philippe as well.  I would love to hear your thoughts on how Father Hubbard and Philippe are similar/dissimilar.

Can't wait for your next episode!


Take 37 (published the 26th of April 2018) emails

**From Patricia:
Good morning Daemons Val, Angela and Jean,

Here are some my thoughts on Chapter 13 and Chapter 14 of SoN.

Chapter 13 was intense. For me it was a lot of push and pull from the archery, the emotions and the carnal appetites of Diana and Matthew. :)
Couple of things that stood out for me on this re-read.
"Close your eyes before you aim" (said MC to Diana.)
For me this is a powerful metaphor for life.
Yes, it is nice to have goals and objectives yet at a certain point, trust that life is happening the way it is supposed to be happening
Listening to your instincts can be powerful and at times frightening

Mathew is curious about how Diana succeeded in archery when she closed her eyes during archery
Understanding how something works or how someone does something is a challenging question
Very scientific type of question and I've often found myself in situations where I do something and can't always explain how
For example, this used to frustrate the hell out of me with math questions, I don't now how I got the answer, just knew that I was right
Seems like Mathew is trying to use the scientific method on Diana to understand her powers

Diana mentions that she feels "there is invisible potential beyond her grasp"
This comment made me think of the power of yoga and taichi and other energy based fitness
I've always been attracted to this kind of fitness, some strange way of feeling healthier and stronger and not really understanding how it works
I've practiced both TaiChi and Yoga off and on for years and yes, I do there there is invisible potential (energy) out there for anyone to tap into

Phillipe's wisdom and the tearful goodbye
"Revenge is never an adequate remedy for loss" are words in Chapter 13 that echo to my core.
So many wars could have been avoided, more lives could be saved and less chaos if humanity was less vengeful
Felt sad reading this chapter as Diana says goodbye to Phillipe and lives with the heavy burden of knowing his future

Chapter 14
For me this was not an anomaly at all, it was a perfect distraction from the heaviness of Chapter 13.
Fun to see how notes are put in books for Ysabeau to find and what I joy to find her singing again
Ysabeau had a moment of happiness after a long period of grief, the power of love, immortal in words :)

That's it for me,

Looking forward to the next show.

Take care.

From Stephen:

Hello again, delicious Daemons,
The One With the Target Practice, or Zen and The Art of Archery, trying to allow the idea of self to drop away, to stop influencing or interfering with the skill in archery.

I like that Diana was reminded that Matthew made removing the cork from a champagne bottle look easy. My preferred method here is to hold the cork firmly, and twist the champagne bottle. However, I am happy to continually practice opening bottles and not assume that I have learnt everything to know on the subject. (Like the euphemistic 'target practice' in this chapter, I am happy with continual practice, he he).

I didn't know that the expression 'fortnight' ( from fourteen nights, or two weeks) was not commonly used in American English. Great to see this brought up on the Discussor Facebook group.

I had forgotten that this was the chapter where Diana promised Philippe that she would  "find a way to be with him in the darkness, and would hold his hand". As I mentioned in my last mail, I believe that an older Diana will time-walk back to 1945 to give comfort and support to Philippe. I'm sure I read that Philippe ( alive and dead) will appear in the forthcoming book, Time's Convert. Maybe this will be included in the new book. My copy is on order and eagerly awaited.


From NE Angela:

Good morning Daemons

Not sure if this has ever been discussed previously but in chapter 14 Tabitha makes her reappearance in the series. Here we see her fly into the room amidst all the chaos from Ysabeau's failed search and search out one particular book. The alchemy book that Diana had loved reading. Was it chance that led Tabitha to the book? Magic? Or is it possible that by this point in the timey-whimeyness she is a reincarnated creature?

Is it possible that part of Philippe lives inside of her? Tabitha loved Matthew yet didn't warm up to Diana until she returned to Sept Tours in TBOL.

When Tabitha hovered over the piece of paper that fell to the floor Deb wrote "hovering over her prize like a lion". And there is only one lion in this family and Deb usually doesn't use words that don't have significant meaning.

Other things that lead me to believe Tabitha is something besides just a cat...she despised Miriam in ADOW, would never go into Marthe's stillroom, she constantly stared at the burning wood in the fireplaces, and picked up the tension between family members "with uncanny precision."

Makes you wonder if there is more to her than what we are lead to believe.

That's all for now ladies

Daemon Kisses

Take 35 (published the 29th of March 2018) emails

From Asli:
Hey Daemons!

Newbie discusser here.I've binge listened all of the back catalogue since I have found out the podcast.Too much laughter was involved on my part,thanks to you ,especially Jean ;)

Can I say I love Philippe? He is one of the most unique characters in these books I think and we didn't even had enough time with him.I hope we hear more about his backstory in the future. Loved the blood rage reveal scene,loved how he gave a chance to Diana to prove herself.I can see him managing that family with all of those strong willed vampires,but not because of the secrets he keeps.Because he knows and reads everyone so well,also most importantly he knows when to tell the truth unlike Matthias.

Thanks for keeping us laughing,having so much fun with you guys!

Daemon kisses,


**From Melanie:
Greetings Daemons!

Thoughts on Chapter 11:
For someone so worried about how their being in the past impacts the future, I found it interesting to read Diana writing in the margins of "de Clermont alchemical books". Wouldn't she be worried about others seeing a strange hand in the book?

Philippe baits Matthew so well in the hay barn scene. You'd think someone like Matthew with his years of experience of being around Philippe would have taught him what his Father was trying to do....but I guess it's a real show of how the blood rage effects Matthew and it's truly the first time we see how animalistic he can be when provoked.

I think back on the first read and this is where we truly see the complexity of Philippe and the compassion and love he has for Matthew. When he forgives him, it is heartbreaking. I cannot imagine what it would be like to be in Matthew's shoes and have to go back and see his Father, knowing what was in his future and the part he played....:-(

I think often on the scene of him making Diana his blood sworn daughter....and the rippling effect it would have on her future. And I wonder, did he know what could potentially happen? Or just amazing instincts? Or both?

Champier - I hate this scene (although I of course understand the way in which it is important to the plot). I actually always feel like Philippe lets it go on longer than it should. How would he know the impacts of his reading her mind?! But the one question that always comes to mind is, what was Champier thinking before Diana plunged the dagger into his heart? That she was a time walker? That she was a Weaver? I always wonder and I don't believe we ever know and are made to surmise...


**From Lauren:
Hi Daemons!

I made a new discovery (to me) and have tried to figure out for the last few hours why Deb chose to quote Euripides 3 times in the hay barn sword fight.

"Don't consider painful what is good for you,"
muttered Matthew

"(I have been thinking of Diana.) Neither earth nor ocean produces a creature as savage and monstrous as woman,"
Philippe said sorrowfully.

"Those whom the gods wish to destroy, they first make mad."
Philippe's words caused Matthew to falter. (Although this line is often attributed to Euripides, it is actually considered to be from an anonymous ancient proverb, but it does fit the scene).

None of these lines quite fit Deb's writing style, but there was a clue which I've ignored through all of my re-reads.

Matthew swore. "Did you give away all of your best lines?" he demanded.

Euripides is the youngest of a trio of Athenian Tragedians, which include Sophocles and Aeschylus from 400's BC. Apparently, his lasting impact on modern drama is his representation of traditional mythical heroes as ordinary people in extraordinary circumstances.

I have always read this scene as a way for Philippe to teach Diana about blood rage and bring her into the family. But the third leg of this scene is Philippe's forgiveness of Matthew for his supposed blood rage induced murder, and this is where Euripides play, Hippolytus comes into action. Hippolytus is the illegitimate son of Theseus, King of Athens, who pisses off Aphrodite by taking a vow of chastity and honoring Artemis instead. Of course, Aprhodite must make him regret his choice. His step-mother Phaedra has decided she has fallen in love with Hippolytus while Theseus is exiled for a year for murdering a king. Hippolytus spurns her so she hangs herself and leaves a note accusing him of rape. Theseus discovers her body and her note. Everyone of interest was sworn to secrecy and could not defend Hippolytus. Theseus won't believe his son's denials and uses one of his 3 wishes from his father Poseidon to have Hippolytus killed. As he is dying, Artemis appears, rages against Theseus and opens his eyes to the fact that Hippolytus was innocent. And here is the key: as he lays dying, Hippolytus tells Theseus, "I release you from this blood-guilt".

I now feel the need to go through each book and each chapter with a fine toothed comb. Thanks, Deb.


**From Patricia
Greetings  daemon ladies,

Chapter 11 thoughts: authentic views

 Philippe outs Mathew’s blood rage illness in front of Diana. This action carried me away in the emotional rollercoaster that followed.

 I felt empathy for Mathew, unable to stop what Philippe started. Could not be easy to reaveal to anyone that you have a genetic sickness let alone be seen at the worse stage.

I also felt so sad for Diana who is pregnant and watching this and realizes that there their children could now be cariers or be born with full blood rage. She also expresses a new understanding of Mathew’s protectiveness and where this behaviour came from.

Philippe’s forgiveness of Mathew was a suprising added layer in this chapter. It was beautiful, raw and a little ugly. I understand that one of his other motives in triggering the blood rage was to publicly forgive Mathew for future killing him. Mathew seems to accept it and yet he continues his pattern of lying by omission. He does not clarify that blood rage was not the reason that Philippe died. Could also be that he  can’t because discussing a future event is not allowed when time walking.

Last thoughs. Diana the kickass is revealed. She kills Champier in a preemptive way. She used the “Think and Stay Alive” motto of Philippe to protect herself in this past. Also a twisted test planted by Philippe. Ironically, she reveals her true nature while hiding some truths. And finding out that Diana and Mathew will have a real wedding was a great way to finish the chapter and keep me hooked. Two killers, two lovers making no apologies for who they are and moving on with their lives. In Philipe’s words,  “You cannot hold up a dead weight “

Have a great weekend ladies.


From Ashley:
Dear Daemons Discuss,

First I want to say how much I am enjoying the pod cast. I just found it last week and I knew right away that you were my type of people. I am currently binge listening to the podcasts and am on The One With the Visions, the Vow and the Venetian ADOW ch 21-25.  I was so excited when I opened my email and saw my first discusser  email, so I reread the ch 11 in SON so I would be able to share my thoughts with someone other than myself.

On to my thoughts about chapter 11. This is one of my favorite chapters, it is where I really started to like Philippe. Up until now I didn't have a good feeling about him. Even though this chapter is kinda on the serious side there were three times that I couldn't help but chuckle.  The first was when Philippe told Matthew to meet him in the hay barn and Diana asked what is in the hay barn and Matthew says "Hay" I just imagined him being so sarcastic and annoyed. Next is when Philippe yells to Alain and tells him that they should not be bothered and he says "I had apprehended as much, sieur," This to me is like he is saying ok..... chill. The last one is at the end of the chapter after Diana kills Champier and Philippe says " Alain, Pierre, please remove Monsieur Champier, He is upsetting madame."  I could see Philippe saying this as if he were talking about a painting or a vase.

On a serious note by the end of this chapter I was as in love with Philippe as Matthew. Philippe may have been the ultimate monjasang head of the family, but he obviously had a soft side and knew exactly what Matthew needed and when. There is so much I could say about this chapter but this is what comes to mind first. Sorry this is so long if I wrote everything I thought about this chapter it would be several pages long.

Thank you for all that you do I am looking forward to hearing your thought on this chapter.


**From NE Angela:
Good morning ladies.

Let me start off my saying chapter 11 may just be my absolute favorite chapter in SON. Needless to say I could spend hours talking about everything that happens in this chapter. But I'll keep this as brief as I can despite the number of highlighted text and sticky notes along the edges of these pages.

I love the humor right from the start. "What's in the hay barn?" - Diana ... "Hay." - Matthew

I love how we learn a little more about the family tree. Louis, Stasia, Verin, Freyja are all introduced. Deb's detail on Stasia being able to strip paint from walls just looking at them and Freyja being named after the Norse Goddess of war. Philippe never chose a daughter who wasn't strong and fearless which is why making Diana his bloodsworn daughter in this chapter is so achingly special. And then Louis and his wife Margot leading a life of sin and Louis faking his own death. Anyone out there want to know where that couple ended up later on?? I wonder if this will be revealed in TWOAS?!?

Then we get the first mention of dear old Benjamin. During that initial read of this book I think I always just glanced over that name and the little details that were dropped about him in this chapter.

"Those whom the gods wish to destroy, they first make mad." -Philippe

Benjamin certainly had no problem making those in his path equally as mad as he was.

Shortly after we get the glimpse of those inky black eyes and Matthew's blood rage consuming his body. Philippe uttering those famous words...Think...Stay Alive. Then Philippe starts to put pieces together and realizing Diana was the reason he lost the battle in Madison against Juliette. Then he reveals what he believes was what torments Matthew so much. His own death coming at Matthew's hands. Despite not truly knowing the details Philippe plays a different role here. Almost as though he's asking Matthew not to confess his sins, but to free himself of them.

"...accept who you are..." "...when you put your mother's ring on Diana's finger, did you take the time to consider what it promises?"

"My whole life, and the end of it. And a warning to remember the past."

"I know what you have done."..."Do you hear me, Matthew? I know my future."

"I forgive you." ..."Je suis desole."

After Philippe makes Diana his blood sworn daughter we meet Champier. And this section still leaves me with questions.

"A witch's skin can be read, like a book." - Champier

Odd that this line would be included here when later in TBOL Diana becomes a book.

Then I've always wondered what exactly Champier sees before Diana kills him. Does he see she's a weaver? Or is that vision something entirely different?

The chapter closes out with the set up for the big wedding and Phillipe's line to Matthew that always touches my heart.

"Know this too: You are equally worthy of her. Stop regretting your life. Start living it."

And this is where Matthew's transformation into a different vampire begins to shine for me after this chapter. He's absolved himself of so many past haunts and secrets he's held inside that now he truly can begin living life.

That's all for now Daemons.

Can't wait to hear all your thoughts on this chapter in the podcast.


From Stephen:
I liked Philippe's attempt to get a reaction from Matthew, by proposing Marguerite de Valois, the Queen of Navarra, as a role model for Diana ' to behave like a proper French lady '. Marguerite, or Margot was known to have had several romantic scandals. At that time, Margot was still imprisoned in Usson , although her original captor and brother, Henri,  had been assassinated the year before, in 1589.



Take 33 (published the 1st of March 2018) emails

From Stephen:  
Hello delicious daemons

Two new things jumped out to me on my latest read of chapter nine.

When Diana was smelling  the Rosemary from Marthe's cutting table, did she almost make a transitory connection through time to Rima in the 21st century, while Rima herself was sniffing the remains of the Rosemary left in Diana's own commonplace book?

I like the different scents associated with the characters, and in this chapter Louisa is described as having the scent of roses and Civet ( a natural animal ingredient formerly included in some premium perfume, like Chanel No 1) . I think that Deborah must have a wine tasting aroma set for inspiration , plus picking scents of sulphur/ brimstone, incense and the natural ingredients of perfume ( ambergris, musk and cevit)


P.S. In The Book of Life, when Diana first visits the Congregation in Venice, Rima asks ' Pardon my presumption, Madame, but have we met? You seem so familiar.'
This shows the tentative connection from Shadow of Night.

**From Jody: 
Hello Darling Daemons,

Before I respond to Chapter 9,  I want to tell you how happy I was to wake up & see The One with the Prince notification this morning.  I just can't take another minute of the news these days.  Your episodes are always a welcome companion during my daily 30 minute commute to the school where I teach. Thank you.

On to Chapter 9:
I always have more questions than answers when it comes to Philippe and I am always both thoroughly annoyed and amused by Philippe's antics in this chapter.  He toys with both Diana and Matthew like a cat (lion) playing with its prey.  He must know that his unregulated movement startles Diana and his voice resonates in her ears. He flings insults at Matthew and gets him all riled up. Then he smoothly switches to linguistic challenges and hands her the keys to the household.  On first read, I didn't realize he was testing her.  In fact, it wasn't until he confesses his plan in later chapters that I understood what he was up to.

This chapter also makes my heart ache for Matthew, in spite of his constant brooding , secret-keeping and crappy plan-making. He is truly tortured by the thought of losing Diana and is still trying to give her an out.  He just can't seem to accept her love and faithfulness.  And we soon find out why in another heart wrenching confession, but I digress.

So Diana goes about her business of trying to blend it and the scent of rosemary triggers a memory.  She sees the blue and amber threads and senses another creature in another time.  This made me very uneasy the first time I read it, especially after the previous chapter's talk of Gerbert. But now I wonder was it Steven??? If not Steven, who could it be?

Diana, Alain, and Pierre discuss the upcoming celebrations. I've mentioned this before but the talk of Saturnalia and Christmas reminds me of a song by Dar Williams, "The Christians and the Pagans."

Anyway, Matthew finally returns.  The ride with Philippe has settled him and his spirits are high.  What did they talk about while they were gone? And why is Philippe suddenly deferring to her and his voice now friendly?   Diana is unnerved by a warning gaze and believes he is up to something.  Ha!  That's an understatement!!!  Again, at first read this felt foreboding and dangerous.  Now I'm not really sure why he was warning her.  If Steven really was in cahoots with Philippe, why did he feel the need to test her so?  Was it just to verify Steven's story? Was he still just making sure she loved Matthew and would be loyal to him and the de Clermonts?

More questions than answers, I'm afraid!

So excited to purchase Con passes and looking forward to upcoming episodes and my Daemons tote bag! Yaaaay!
Thanks for all you do,

From Melanie:
Greetings Daemons!

Chapter 9 thoughts:
Wait, they serve spiced wine for breakast?! We need to bring that tradition to present day! :P
Once again we see how Matthew's emotions get the better of him and prove his short-sightedness when he discusses wanting to leave Sept-Tours immediately.
Diana manages quite well in learning the household and working with Alain/Pierre and Chef!

One of my favorite quotes from this section: "We don't lock up books in this house," Philippe said, "only food, ale and wine. Reading Herodotus or Aquinas seldom leads to bad behavior". I think this is where we see Philippe's humor come through for the first time. I recall being annoyed with him the first time through at this point, but rereading this section always makes me chuckle. He's quite humorous!

From Angela:
Good morning Lady Daemons

One quick question on chapter 9...

Did anyone else notice the key words at the beginning of the chapter were cold driven and by the end of the chapter there is a "spring thaw" and the cold words disappear? Almost as though Diana has broken through the ice and Philippe is now warming up to her presence.

Love the chapter and Diana learning to play house and outsmarting Philippe at his "game"

Daemon Kisses!

From Iwona:
Hello Daemons,

Wow! I cannot believe I have had the time to read, listen and respond to your email this one time!

I love Matthew's seemingly out of place whisper on the boat at the start of this chapter: "Immensi tremor oceani"..."the trembling of the immense ocean". I never knew what to make of it, but for me, with the more re-reads I do, this phrase is a glimpse into Matthew's soul. It is his ocean of emotions that are trembling and the precariousness of the opening scene, and indeed the whole journey to Sept-Tours really accentuates this. Even though the chapter seems to start with Matthew leading, by the time we meet Philippe, Diana is stepping forward and already winning him over with her candour and transparency.

My first impression of Philippe on my first read, was pretty ambivalent at this stage; it was clear he was powerful, but as to whether he was going to be likeable or be an ally was not apparent for me until further on. Of course, with each re-read, I now recognise characteristic parts of Philippe I love here and now, knowing what is coming, I see him differently. What a fantastic character! I am really looking forward to hearing more about his background - I hope you have time to touch on that - Hercules etc. I've not had a chance to dig through this material myself, but am intrigued by it.

I also noticed that on this re-read, Matthew Goode and Teresa Palmer have completely embodied the roles of Matthew and Diana in my mind. I can't wait to see who will play Philippe - this is gonna be a tough role to cast!

Thanks Daemons - have a great show!

Love Iwona from Australia.
(PS Iwona is pronounced Yvonn-a - just in case you end up reading any portion of this :) - Of course, no problems if not!)


Take 31 (published the 1st of February 2018) emails

**From Patricia: 
Rima Jaรฉn is a fascinating character, I immediately sympathized with her on how there is very little love for the month of November. In my part of the world it is also dark, cold, rainy (sometime snowy) and foggy.Usually about the time I start thinking of a sun vacation and leaving all the lights on in the house on purpose because of lack of natural light.

I love how Deb weaves all kinds of fun historical tidbits in this chapter such as the``reconquista`, Berber culture, Muslim religion (Prophet's daughter) and hints at the areas of Andalusia and Seville. I immediately had a sense of rich history in this place where Rima lived. The implication that she has found Diana`s `Commonplace book` adds a layer of mystery and detective work and made this chapter fun to read. We also find out that Gerbert D`Aurillac may have had an alias of Gerbert Cantal and has been snooping around the library. I found that I had a new awareness when I read this chapter again with the #metoo movement very much in the media.  Rima,'s encounter with "Daniel from building maintenance" is to me very disrespectful and like many women have stated, it is not flirting if is not reciprocal. If you think this last sentence is political, take it out, I'm fine with that, just seem topical to me in today's environment. Last thought I had about the "Commonplace" book was about the idea that 400 years later, there is no proof of someone's existence because of anonymity. In today's world, we have Facebook pages and other social media pages that continue to live after a person dies and yet we can't really confirm that anything is really authentic on many of these pages as so much is staged. Will future historians will likely dig through the "facade" to find the real person ?

Have a great day and look forward to the podcast.


From Kit:
Hello daemons! Happy 2018!

I started a reread (my first ever) a few weeks ago intending roughly to keep time with y’all’s episodes…and completely drove into a ditch and reread the entire series in about a week. (I suspect other discussers have similar stories!) But this time around I highlighted a ton in my Kindle, so, pulling quickly from chapters 7/8/9 of SON:

—I was relieved on my first read to see we would still be getting glimpses of the present and how the timey-wimey-ness of D + M in the past would affect things, and although Rima isn’t much as a character in terms of overall plot, I really feel Deb’s historianness and the emotion the past can bring out in chapter 7. Most if not all of us will be filed as “Anonymous, of no importance” if anything of ours ever reaches the archivists of several centuries from now, so I find this short “anomaly” quite touching, as well as exciting to see glimpses of Fernando, little do we know it at this point.

From Angela:
Hello Lady Daemons!

Since I know the majority of the podcast will probably surround Phillipe and Sept Tours I'll tackle the Rima Jaen chapter. My first read of this chapter left me befuddled...yes I said befuddled. Why? Well, because here we are given this little flash forward to witness just how Diana and Matthew's time travel has changed the future. Rima finds Diana's commonplace book. Despite my initial reaction of suspicion and dislike of Rima I couldn't help but wonder how she was going to be important in the big picture. Especially when Gerbert was snooping around. Of course we certainly get those answers later in TBOL however my question still lingers on how she became a part of the Congregation panel of help. We know she wears the amulet in hope of warding off evil spirit but clearly that doesn't work in keeping Gerbert away or preventing her from getting mixed up in Congregation business. Was it him who helped her get her foot in that door or someone else ? See ...even after 5 rereads I still miss a ton of details .

Take 29 (published the 4th of January 2018) emails

From Lauren:
Hi Daemons!

In 5 and 6 we continue with new interrogations of Diana, which at this point have moved past the function of showing her fish out of water story and are now used as a tool to illustrate the devolution of Matthew's control and confidence. The tenuous threads he has used to hold everything in place begin to snap and his secrets spill all over the floor. Philippe's letter may have been hard to handle, but it certainly saved him from Diana's frustration and fury.

Gallowglass is introduced as the voice of reason and levity to further illustrate that Matthew is losing his grasp of the situation at hand. He steps onto the scene demanding answers but also ready to defend the family in an instant. It's interesting that he's at Diana's back during the Danforth interrogation and holds her shoulders and supports her when she is accused of being a witch. I have to wonder if Gallowglass called Matthew Uncle before the introduction of Diana.

From Stephen:
Hello Daemons I hope you are all well.

One thing that always strikes me when meeting Gallowglass for the first time ( on each re- read or re-listen), is just how quickly he takes to his new auntie, even though he realises that she does not " smell right" for her time ( and Matthew smells much too old). Gallowglass is quick to support Diana when she stumbles, touching her without asking permission from her mate. Matthew appears very comfortable to accept this help from Gallowglass and confirms this protection role, by insisting that either one or both of them keep Diana under observation al all times.

Getting a bit ahead of the reading, but have we heard more of Davy Hancock, after 1591

That's all for now


**From Jody:
Hi Ladies,

This is my first official discusser reply! Yay! I respond all the time in my head but have never been able to sit & gather my thoughts in time. The chapters are so packed I probably won't do them justice. I'm running out of time so please excuse my fragmented thoughts & sentences:

Thoughts on Chapters 5:
The appearance of Gallowglass & Hancock! I was very leery the first read but each reread has endeared them to me more & more. They are hilarious! Why does GG see Diana's glaem? No other vampire commented before -- did they? Why can Hancock hear her blood? I know Matthew can. I think Ysabeau can too. Is this just a vampire thing? Or was Diana's agitation causing it?

Omg. The Congregation?!? Didn't see that coming but in hind sight it makes sense. But between that and Berwick & as we find out, Elizabeth I, it seems 1590 was a risky choice!

Hancock again--" the age of miracles had passed." True frat boy behavior!!! ๐Ÿ˜‚ This reminds me of attending the wedding of one of my husband's friends who was never expected to settle down.

And George & Kit-- I imagine them with a supersized popcorn and coke watching this all play out.

I find it interesting that Gg and Hc are not loyal to Baldwin. Why?? And not to Matthew when he behaves like a fool. I thought that was foreshadowing but never seemed to materialize.

Matthew's scent makes Hc ill. Totally understand. As much as I am Team Matthew, the smell of cinnamon & cloves gives me a headache!

Then Matthew finally explodes & wonders why everyone is giving him advice on how to "handle" his wife. Oh Matthew. Poor guy. He just needs some peace & quiet.
The parallels between Ysabeau & Diana are also further solidified here.

I love the strategic positioning when Danforth & Ifflely & Bidwell arrive.  The School of Night are so blasรฉ about their visitors. I wonder here, if Matthew's  reasoning for choosing Widow Beaton was also in case she betrayed them & started spreading rumors as she did. He clearly dismisses her saying he doesn't share his personal life with the likes of women like WB.

Okay. This is lengthy & I haven't even touched chapter 6. And my day is starting so  I don't have time to do it justice. My last thought will be the one moment when my heart broke for Kit.
"..only Matthew can see what little good I have in me. Leave him to me. Please.”

“I can’t,” I said.

Kit truly loved Matthew & is devastated. But instead of acquiescing to Matthew's happiness, he turns into a jealous meddler. Ugh.

This chapter ends with the very beginning of my favorite part of the whole trilogy. Matthew, Phillipe, & Diana in Sept-Tours.

Wow. Thanks for reading!!
Happy Friday!๐Ÿ–ค๐Ÿ’ซ๐Ÿ˜˜

Take 26 (published the 21st of November, 2017) emails

From Stephen:
Hi daemons
Regarding Diana's list of Elizabethan English coins, recorded in her commonplace book, this system remained up to 1971, when the UK adopted a decimal currency with 100 new pennies to the pound.
The gold sovereign had been replaced by a paper pound note, but I was schooled with 20 shillings to the pound, and 12 pennies to the shilling. We had a 10 shilling note ( half a pound) and the largest coin was the half-crown ( two shillings and six pence, or one eighth of a pound). The other coins in circulation were; two shillings ( called a florin), the shilling, the sixpence, the threepence ( an eight-sided brassy coin), the penny, and the half-penny.  The farthing ( or fourth part of a penny) was withdrawn while I was still a baby.
No voice mail this time, as we are on holiday in Portugal.

**From Lauren:
SON Chapter 1

I am always struck by how Diana first experiences 1590 through scent and sound. Deb is already painting her scenes of senses in my mind.

Immediately striking about the first chapter of SON is how much more active it is than the first chapter of ADOW. ADOW had so much exposition and world building it is a much slower start to a book. In this chapter we meet 5 new characters and hear mention of 2 more. Kit’s jealously drives the conflict and and his demonic need to pick apart the threads of story forces everyone into their roles.

We have Kit playing the villain to Matthew’s hero and Diana’s fairly firm return to the victim. Her fish out of water storyline sets up the movement of the first act and the creates the beginning low point of her rising global internal story of weak and helpless to powerful and confident.

The emotional shift slips from excitement and exhilaration to anxiety and caution.
SON Chapter 2

This chapter is exposition heavy and fairly static. We get the details of dressing Diana, the interplay of the School of Night and how they process the tale and time unspooling. in the corner. We have the introduction of Henry Percy, who is the picture of brotherly kindness to Diana, and Walter Raleigh, our first mental and oratorical equal to Matthew.

We have another collective of a witch, vampire, demons and humans working for the good of the individuals and the whole group. While different from yoga, it illustrates that Matthew has been mixing with other creatures and flaunting the Congregation for hundreds of years.

“No fraternizing between otherworldly species” was the most important rule, and the Congregation policed the boundaries. Our talents—creativity, strength, supernatural power—were impossible to ignore in mixed groups. It was as if the power of a witch highlighted the creative energy of any nearby daemons, and the genius of a daemon made a vampire’s beauty more striking.”

Kit continues to antagonize Diana and Matthew, in the same vein as Ch. 1. The conflict is a little weak as Kit has tantrums and the adults in the room repeatedly shut him down.

I would place the value shift in this chapter from ignorance to awareness, for all characters who participate in the chapter.

Thomas Harriot invokes Janus as representative of Matthew and Diana’s time spinning dilemma and why the SoN need to accept rather than dissect their motivations (an ancient Italian deity, guardian of doorways and gates and protector of the state in time of war. He is usually represented with two faces, so that he looks both forward and backward.) “With one face, Matthew and Diana look to the past. With the other, they consider the future,”

I thoroughly enjoy the imagery of time unspooling in the corner. Of note, the scent of lavender and rosemary in the rushes, the sound of the bells rolling 12 and the sight of the tight blue and amber weaving all draw her back to Madison. This doesn’t get fully explained until much later, but it was impressive to see it so fully detailed this early.

From Ed:
Regarding Shadow of Night: as a professional historian myself (though not an early modernist like Deb), I find that the layers of detail in this book make it my favorite in the series.  It’s a fictionalized but realistic look at daily life in early modern England, France, and Bohemia, and not just from the top of society.  From Bedlam’s din to the vagaries of international travel, Deb gives the readers a real view into what certain aspects of life were like at the time.  The quote from L.P. Hartley that “the past is a foreign country; they do things differently there” is especially applicable, and it’s interesting watching Diana get immersed in much of what she’s studied, and how Matthew tries to take the second chance he’s been given to do things differently but finds that he often can’t, or that things turn out the same even if he does do something differently.  I was actually a bit disappointed to finish this book and move back to the twenty-first century.


From New England Angela:
Hello Daemons!

I have to agree that SON is my favorite book in the trilogy. It's so full of history and emotions. My heart busts at the seams every time I read the Sept Tours section.

Who wouldn't?! word...Phillipe!

But as we start in the new time with D&M my first reaction is why is Kit just lounging around by himself at Matthew's longing for his "Sweet Matt"?
Not creepy at all!

And the we meet the cast of characters in the School of Night who upon seeing Matthew all ask
"Matthew are you ill?"
Oh...just a touch of the ague. Nothing to worry about here.

I absolutely loved Diana being out of her element. Her magic is all messed up. She's considered a giant and everyone assumes she's a harlot and Matthew's whore. Well Diana welcome to the 16th century...can't someone just get the girl a cup of tea, some clothes and a bum donut?! And while we are at it a little support for the poor girl. She did just have a bit of a long journey.

Talk soon daemons

Take 25 (published the 9th of November, 2017) emails

** From Wendy:
Hello Lady Daemons!!

Brace yourselves...this one is going to be long!! Thoughts on the podcast, thoughts on ADOW and questions for Dr. you go!!!

The Podcast - this is jumbled a bit:
The house's magic is like grimauld place in Harry just is there when you need it and not when you don't (or when the house thinks you don't!!)

About Matthew's comment where he wouldn't trust his 1590 self with Diana... I thought maybe none of them understood what happens to a person that goes back to a time they were in previously.  Once they go back, memories, opinions and behaviours come flooding back and go to the forefront of his/her mind.

I like that Nathaniel challenges Matthew and his plans and tries to bring him back to the 21st century.  Matthew's plan is based on ancient warfare not current methods....almost like Matthew has already slipped back in time and Nathaniel is trying to bring him forward.

When they are talking about the wills, I love that Diana said it was for all children of her and Matthew, and included his vampire children.  It was almost as if she knew that there were more children than she knew about at that point.

The trick or treaters were so cute!'  I had a serious awwwwww moment when Matthew was with the little princess who kept hitting him with her wand and saying Bibbity bobbity boo!!

Final thoughts on ADOW...after reading all three books multiple times and thinking back on all of them, it almost feels like these are much younger versions of Matthew and Diana in ADOW as compared to the other two books.  Even though they are only technically a year older in BOL, in experience and life lived, it feels like they age and mature so much more after this book is over.  ADOW is kind of their teenaged or young adult versions of who they become in the other books (despite their chronological age).

Questions for Dr. Shelli...there are so many!!  What is the science behind Diana's having a vampire and witch baby?  If they are twins, shouldn't they be the same type of creature?  Or is this the same as a human mother having twins with different skin colours...changes happening while the baby is forming in the uterus?  I can't remember if she already answered this one, so if she did, please skip it!!

Looking forward to more podcasts and Facebook discussions!

** From Patricia:
Hello daemons, my favourite mad, bad and dangerous to know ladies. ๐Ÿ˜

Always a joy to listen to your podcast and read the posts in daemonic discussers.

It was amazing for me to see all the feedback I received about my question on the validity of DNA tests and how Dr. Shelli answered so swiftly to my concerns.

Final thoughts on ADOW is that it is the book that I have re-read the most out of the trilogy, probably because of the real time readings. I love how the topic of grief is explored in the books. Personally, I have lost three people during the last 12 months. The book offers me comforting concepts like the idea of communicating with deceased relatives to get advice and encouragement. The last sentence of the book is also so powerful. “Remember the past - and await the future”. I strive to do this by remembering the gifts of those who have passed by living the best I can in the moment and believing the future can be magical. (Intention made real)

Recently signed-up for the Saturnalia card exchange and I’m looking forward to finding the perfect card for my assigned partner from Facebook AllSouls Discussion group.

Also very excited to see more casting announcements for the TV show and I love watching Teresa Palmer’s Instagram stories.

Bye for now.


Take 23 (published the 13th of October, 2017) emails:
From Stephen:
Hello Daemons
When Matthew gave Diana his mobile (cell) before going hunting with Marcus, he explained the speed dial numbers 2 and 3 were programmed for Marcus and Ysabeau.
Whom do you think is reached with speed dial number 1?
My guess is Hamish.

Also, have you ever smelled ambergris ( or gray amber)?
This is reported to be a natural discharge from the stomach of sperm whales, and used as an ingredient in some perfume. Matthew smelled this after Diana used witchfire to save him from Juliette.

From Kate:
I was thinking about (again clothes, *sigh*) how Marcus has his necklace of memories. It is obviously full of special momentoes, though he loves Matthew enough to part with one if he has to for Diana and Matthew to travel back in time. But to me, it seems as if Marcus's necklace is his version of a "Matthew Museum." And how American frontiersman of it. Marcus comes from a background of unsettled society and war. No guarantee of a homestead, or safe base. Then, American expands west and into the unknown. At the time, to go west must have been the same as colonizing the moon -- no guarantee of a return trip. Again, no safe base, so he had to carry with him all of his possessions, and I wonder if that still stuck for his necklace.

Plus, how more American can Marcus get? He seems to embody the essence of the very country! He's from New England and fought in the American Revolution. He has a frontiersman necklace that would fit in with buckskins. He lived in New Orleans just after the War of 1812, and is described as looking like a blonde surfer from California. Throw in the fact he probably fought in the American Civil War, and let's pretend he was in Chicago working with Capone in the 1920s and 30s, and he's done everything!

Love the podcast as always,

**From NE Angela
Good evening Daemons!

I don't really know why I'm going to attempt to discuss much of anything tonight on chapters since Deb decided to do a book boyfriend poll online today and well... Jean...BALDWIN. I mean really need we say any more than that?!

Although I think Jean and I are secretly joining Team James quickly after today's Twitter posts from Adam Stevenson. What a little cutie pie that one is!

But back to chapter discussions...

Chapter 35.

Yes...ok let's examine a page of dead skin by placing it on the dining room table. Tea anyone? LOL. First image that came to mind was the scene from National Treasure when they look for the secret messages on the back of the Declaration of Independence... This totally could be Diana, Matthew and Marcus. Except tea.

I love how the topic of Marthe's special tea finally came to the forefront in this chapter.

"Sarah sniffed. 'I would have thought you'd go to the doctor for a prescription, not depend on old herbal lore.'"

Sarah knew immediately, but Diana was completely oblivious still. And before you know it Matthew had Diana pinned against the apple tree in the yard, the Grimoire comes out and Marcus and Miriam have arrived.

"Hi, Mom, we're home!"....oh Marcus there really is no way we couldn't love you completely at this point.

Chapter 36.

Now that Diana is aware that "Conceptio" is the next step in life and finally begins coming back to reality here is Marcus again with another great line.

"It's a vampire thing,"..."We're very protective of our spouses."

Cat's out of the bag now. :)

Once this family conversation turns into VTS and chimera talk we start needing Shelli's big white board to plot this all out. Add in the knowledge of Diana being born on the goddess's feast day and how she is the sun and the moon, Sulphur and mercury, and hermaphrodite... and suddenly this family tree is starting to look like my March Madness bracket.

And this is where Shelli enters in and gives us the smart words about Clan Heh and mtDNA that had me sitting at the conference like a deer in the headlights. White board please! and so I married my brother from 5 other mothers...ohhh kayyyy. Can I get some wine over here?!

Where is that vampire when a girl needs some wine?! ...


Back to re-reading now....

Daemon Kisses!

Take 22 (published the 31st of Aug, 2017) emails:
* From Dora:
Hello Dearest Daemons, 
This is a little late, but just in case, I just have to share my thoughts & love for Baldwin. From the very first moment of his arrival at Sept-Tours and really before he even enters the scene, you can feel that something big is coming. I couldn't help when rereading noting the immediate reactions of his family before, he enters the room, Ysabeau's eyes "glisten", Matthew: "stiffens", and Marthe: "rolls her eyes". We learn early on that he is Phillip's Son, most like his father, & his favorite, perhaps the reason for Ysabeau's reaction, that he & Matthew are very different, & do not particularly care or trust one another, revealing a deep sibling rivalry & You are made very aware that Marthe doesn't take his nonsense, lol, the flying cooper kettle! 
Most importantly though, we learn his name almost immediately, that he is an excellent tracker, appears more practical than Matthew, is the Head of the deClermont family & was called for Diana's sake. Despite his flaws, I love his loyalty because he does come when called by his family, he keeps his oath to The Knights of Lazarus, even if he believes Matthew is using this as personal gain & there is concern for his brother, if not in his voice or his actions, it was in his eyes ... love that ❤️ I want him in Matthew's corner ๐Ÿ‘‘
Can't wait to meet you on NOLA, , Love the Podcast, Daemon Kisses
Dora (MidwifeNMoonlover)
** From Rute:
Hello Daemons ๐Ÿ˜‰

Thoughts on Chapters 30-34 of A Discovery of Witches?
Matthew guilt about Diana being kidnap...he reacted just like was expected...taking the blame for falling asleep. The dispear and how crazyhe went looking for Diana, not being able to think but at the same time how he stood up to Baldwin. The all rescue scene ws fantastic and Diana did her part in saving helself and fighting like a real de Clermont woman
Thoughts on meeting Baldwin?
Baldwin is the kind of charater you love to hate...he shows up as if the was the king and ruler of the orders and stuff. Dispite considering Diana os not his or a de Clermont problem he end up going with Matthew to save her and was the one that kept a cool head and told Matthew "Stop and think". You can tell he was a soldier/commander, he knows it is important to keep the calm and think to win ;)
I must confess I didn't like in in ADOW and for the most part of BOF...but when he told Diana "I'll find him Diana and I'll bring him home" we won my heart. I'm really looking forward to know more about him...maybe in Marcus book and in another book. I think he's a very interesting charater and
Thoughts on Sarah and/or Emily?
Sarah was not easy to love at start, how she dealt with Diana not showing any signs of magic, the fach that Diana was just like the mother is mosthave been hard on Sarah (she lost her sister and took care of her niece that "dispises" everything her mother represented, and wants to stay as far as possible from must have been hard on Sarah.
Love how Emily help keep the armony and brings the family together.
Wish we had had more time with these two but it was really cool to see them and how they react to all those things...Diana being with a vampire, Matthew, than Miryam and Marcus, the daemons...
How about that House, eh?
The house is a charater...the secrets, the magic, is was the firts time I heard of a house with a temper....and what a temper. I think that the magic of the former inhabitants kinf of lingers in the house.

Kisses from Portugal ๐Ÿ˜˜๐Ÿ˜˜ 

** From Kate S.
Hello Daemons,

(Warning: this email brings in Book of Life also)

My main thoughts on these chapters are when we meet Baldwin. Having read the series multiple times, I think he is the most interesting but is the most overlooked. All of the reader's interactions and biases of Baldwin are from the other character's point of view. We never get the details of his backstory, as we do for Matthew, Marcus, and Ysabeau.

Here is the second son, who suddenly had to assume the duties of head of the family from Phillipe during war. I doubt he was given time to mourn Phillipe, or even anyone asking how he was doing. Ysabeau was grieving her mate, and Matthew was being self-absorbed Matthew.

Additionally, you can bet that everyone is comparing Baldwin to Phillipe, which is completely unfair. Baldwin was always the strategist, the second in command, not the visionary. All of the characters (except for Ysabeau, maybe) knew Phillipe when he knew what he was doing, essentially the broken in model. It has to be very difficult for Baldwin to suddenly lose his general and best friend ("they are cut from the same cloth...") and try to play both sides against the middle. That takes practice. And information.

Baldwin, though the head of the family, is cut out of the information stream for the entire series! He doesn't know about Diana until Ysabeau calls him one she is kidnapped. Then Marcus doesn't give him all of the information about Emily's death and the shadow-congregation, and no one tells him where Matthew and Diana go when the drop off the radar for about a year, and suddenly arrive at Sept Tours. He even mentions that if he knew Matthew and Diana were there he wouldn't have invited the Congregation representatives over for their inspection.

Because of Matthew's emotional biases, which he passes onto Marcus and are supported (but I don't know why!?!?) by Ysabeau, he can't seem to accept that Baldwin is a good guy. Baldwin is doing what Phillipe did: what is most beneficial for the de Clairmonts and regional stability.  When he arrives, he assumes Phillipe's role: he meets with the mayor and priest in the village, he runs the house and puts Diana on the Congregation.

Has anyone thought of the events of DoW and BoL from his point of view? I think all of his reactions are perfectly acceptable. First, it appears that no one asks his opinion or for his help. They all assume he is against them and approaches him with anger and confrontation. I don't know about you, but if I'm approached in anger, I will become angry and defensive. Initially, he's called in to find his brother's mate, who is a witch. He makes Matthew think instead of just going off his emotions, even though Matthew is angry he's there. Then, the first think Diana says to him is "I thought you were dead." That would freak anyone out, and rightly so. Next, in Book of Life, the reader is led to believe him storming into the bedroom is rude, but let's think:

     1. He doesn't know Matthew and Diana are at Sept Tours
     2. He arrives and suddenly hears Phillipe's blood vow on Diana
     3. Phillipe's been dead for 70 years, and so there is no way that Baldwin would expect to hear that
     4. He is still grieving for Phillipe and it is natural that he would assume that it is some sort of trick/insult to create this reminder of Phillipe

We know he loves his brother. He helps find Diana and gives her good advice, he fights for him and has the reaction of the fake Matthew's in Benjamin's bunker, cares for him after the battle, and makes fun of him while he's recovering (can't fight or do other acceptable brotherly things). Then, he comes to love Diana as a sister. He's the one who confirms the blood vow. He asks Diana if assuming Ashmole 782 hurt, and gently touches her, he gives her advice for being on the Congregation, protects her by waiting on the boat until she's in the meeting, and accepting her as a fellow fighter during the battle with Benjamin, and then caring for Matthew afterward.

In summary, I think Baldwin's reactions are completely reasonable and that he needs a friend/mate. (I'd be it, but I think my husband would protest....even though Baldwin smells like wood smoke and leather...basically the coziest, homiest, and safest den/library I could imagine.) I think it is sad that Baldwin's de Clairmont family is getting smaller. Marcus, his kids, Fernando, and it is assumed Ysabeau join the Bishop-Clairmont scion. Matthew says that vampires like packs, but it seems that the de Claimont pack is trying to push Baldwin out. We don't know with whom Baldwin spends his time. We don't know if Eva was ever his mate or only a lover.

Wow, this ended up being long winded.

I'm totally on #TeamBaldwin

From Michelle:
Hi ladies!

I've been MIA for awhile with life things (exciting life things, not bad life things!) and am now finally catching up with the podcasts. Nothing to really add except that I think of Lucius Vorenus from HBO's Rome when I think of Baldwin - a deep sense of honor and duty and really not here for anyone's (least of all his little "brother's") shit, so it would just be so great if everyone fell in line.

Also, I'm not sure if it's been addressed but can we please talk about how the most unbelievable things in this entire series isn't vampires, witches, daemons, or even timewalking, but the fact that she got tenure. At Yale. By 33.

Love the podcast and am always excited when it comes up in my updates! Sorry I won't be at SoulCon but I'll be busy getting married that weekend :).

Michelle, the INTJ
From Camille:
Hello Daemons! I saw that you were going to discuss the Bishop house and immediately got excited. This house is all of my historical-fantasy dreams come true. Grumpy and wise ancestors. Sassy house. And spirited occupants. Above all else I was mostly interested in the ancestors that still lived, or at least passed by, there. This brings up all sorts of questions, but I mostly want to ask why Diana, Emily, and Sarah don't take advantage of the literal walking, talking history books they have available to them. What gives? Especially Diana, an Historian, who I would think wouldn't be able to stop asking them questions. 

The three women seem to rarely speak to the ghosts and instead have developed a relationship that instead makes it seem like they are houseguests that have overstayed their welcome . And while I do understand that after some time, you might get a bit sick of ghosts always being around, for someone like me who would love to chat with both recent and distant ancestors, I can't help but think the three might be a little ungrateful.  

I love listening to the podcast and cannot wait to stream All Souls Con soon!


From Kate H.:
*Chapters 30-34 were a major emotional roller coaster to read, I distinctly remember stress drinking almost an entire bottle of wine whilst reading them. I would not have handled Diana's ordeal nearly as well as she did. In fact, I'm certain I would not have survived it. 
*Baldwin drove me crazy with his calm rational I really just wanted to smack him. 
*When I first read about the Bishop House it reminded me of a cat. The house is a bit standoffish and wary when it meets a new person but also has a sly and slightly wicked sense of humor. It seems to me that Tabitha often acts as the house's familiar as if she more belongs to the house than the witches who reside there. 
   Hope you enjoy my late night ramblings;)

Take 20 (published the 3rd of Aug 2017) emails:

From Stephen:

I just heard you reading my review on DDE18. I forgot that my Apple ID uses an old email address 'bottleheaduk2002' (so you could not know that it was left by this  Discussor.) I added the podcast subscription to my iPad (just) to leave a review, but I still download and listen in the car with my trusty iPod Touch.
❤  and Daemon kisses ๐Ÿ’‹

* From Wendy:

Hi Lady Daemons!!

I know I am a day late, but hopefully not a dollar

I might be too late for the pod cast but still wanted to share my thoughts.  Chapters 26-29 for me was the roller coaster ride of emotions!!  We went from the high of Matthew finally giving in to his feelings when he got back from Oxford and watching Diana prove her bravery as he hunts, to the pain of Diana in La Pierre.  I think that these chapters start to show the strength of the bond between them.  In Chapters 26-28 we see the beginnings of the bond and how strong it became so quickly and Chapter 29 shows how Diana uses that bond to survive in the some of the darkest moments of her life (to that point).  It also shows Diana's inner strength.  I don't think even she knew how strong she was until that point.

On to Philipe...When we first met Philipe in SON, my impression was of a mean, self important control freak.  As we got to know him more through the book, I realized that my initial impression was too narrow.  He was a control freak, but not mean, just protective.  He was ultimately focused on ensuring the well being, if not happiness, of his family.  He was a complete contradiction in that he had a huge capacity for fun and love for his family...but could also be ruthless and demanding with the them.   Having said that, the scene when he sends Diana and Matthew off to London by riding along the ridge, was heartbreaking.   Philipe is one of those characters that makes you change your mind about him in each chapter...ultimately I think he was the father that Diana needed in SON before they went to London.  He ensured she had the strength and skills she needed to survive and learn in London.

And only 9 more Friday's before All Souls Con...WHOOP!!

Thanks for the shout out on the last was really cool ๐Ÿ˜€๐Ÿ˜€


** From Kate: 

My thoughts on Philippe is that he is the ultimate CEO and put Diana through a medieval executive training course/employment interview. When she arrives, he's not trusting of her and sees her as basically an applicant to being a senior vice president to the de Clarimont Corporation (dCC). At first, he's not sure if she's wanting the role just through the marriage, and will be a satellite member of the family, or if she's going to be a full member. He also realizes that Diana isn't aware that she's even applying for this role!  He essentially puts her on probation to see how she'd do in the position and testing her loyalty to the dCC brand.

- Does she show initiative? Yes. She uses Alain and other retainer/servants to learn how the house and vampire families run, the expectations, requirements, etc. Learning how Philippe and Matthew like to take their blood, that her presence is required at the high table so others can eat, how to deal with strong egos/personalities. This really helps her with Baldwin and the Congregation in Book of Life.

- Does she grow into the role? Yes. She assimilates well and became an advisor to Phillipe and Matthew, not someone to protect, but a full team member.

- Loyalty?
       - She kills the witch and learns how willing she is to protect not just Matthew, but dCC. Also, she learns (and finally accepts!!) that dCC will protect her. This is evidenced when the children servants are willing to use household tools to protect her.

Once she show's that she is worthy, he then hires her into the family through the blood vow and provides her personal seed money. That occurs before the wedding. It's as if Philippe needs to make sure that Diana's not looking to marry Matthew for the prestige of being associated with dCC (gold digger/ trophy wife/ arm candy), and willing to be a working member of it, regardless. The order of events in VERY important. Adoption before the wedding. This is necessary in Book of Life for dCC's modern members to accept the adoption.

In modern life, Phillipe is like Elizabeth II and Diana is like Kate Middleton. One is protecting the family and public institution, and another is training to be a member not just in words but actions too. A 'working royal.'

Again, love the podcast and discussions.


From Rute:

So....I'm going to start with my thoughts on Philippe in SON...we already knew Philippe was one of a kind but in SON we really got to know him. The strong, brave man willing to do everything we could to protect those he love. It was terrible hard and at the same time amazing to see Matthew with Philippe...We could feel Matthew was trouble to be with his father again, and when he told Diana his secret...I can only imagine how hard it must have been to Matthew.

Philippe is someone you find yourself attracted to and falling in love with very easelly...the way he protected Diana, making sure she was a De Clermont. I always cry whe Diana and Matthew have to say such a hard Chapter to read...and latter when Ysabeu finds his little note.
All in all Philippe is an amazing character and I hope to find more about him in future books

Chapters 26-29 of A Discovery of Witches

Matthew finally givin in...telling Diana he loves her. The magic, the I Love Yous, their time together. Matthew taking his time (well, later we find out he was afraid, because of his blood rage and all)...simply perfect. However...when things are this perfect something has to happen...and Satu did
๐Ÿ˜ค Diana being kidnapped...I can only imagine Matthew guild when he woke up. At the same time it show us how strong Diana his...the talk with her mother was amazing.

Guess that's all

Big Kiss

P.S. sorry if there's some mistakes, english is not my mother laguage ;)

** From Angela:
Shadow of Night - Phillipe.

I could probably spend an entire day diving into the many small details of Phillipe. He is by far one of the most complex secondary characters in this book. I won't even go into how many times he brings me to tear up in TBOL. In SON though he not only makes me want to strangle him but I also want to just sit in any room at Sept Tours and just study every move as though each moment with him would have something worth treasuring. And treasure him we do. I don't think I truly understood Phillipe until I went back the second time to read SON. At first so much of his story and the depth at which his relationship with Matthew is overlooked. Once everything is revealed and I went back I really got to see so much more  of those intimate details that occurred in this book. And chapter 11 in the hay barn has got to be one of the most memorable scenes between Phillipe, Diana and Matthew. Not only does Phillipe deliberately instigate Matthew to ensure his secret about his blood rage is revealed to Diana, but this is also where we get to finally see the softer side of Phillipe. By making Diana his blood sworn daughter and giving his blessing for her and Matthew to be officially wed we see there was so much underneath the image of Phillipe that Matthew explained to Diana in ADOW.

Phillipe was a complex yet devoted family man. Who knows just how much he knew about the future and what would actually come into play but I loved every role he played in their lives.

Another question I keep trying to find my answer to and I think I must just be missing it is when Phillipe says to Diana in TBOL- Thank you for holding my hand, you can let go now. Was she with him in spirit while Benajmin was torturing him or was she in some way-shape-or-form guiding him his entire life and never knew it?


I've rambled enough. Time for wine.

I look forward to seeing all your smiling faces in NOLA. And of course I'll bring the wicked Boston accent with me. lol

Daemon Kisses! MUAH

-Angela Page